Last night I attended the Men's Bible Study at our church. Since we just hired a children's pastor I am no longer conscripted to help with the kids on Wednesday Night.
Our topic was Islam. We watched part of a video done by the Southern Baptist Convention on Muslims entitled "Crescent or Cross". Believe it or not, it was well done. It showed Muslims not as the bloodthirsty terrorists we often see on TV. But it showed them as peaceful, intellectual and friendly. It was very disarming and I could tell it was really challenging the men in the group.
We had a time of discussion after watching about half of the video. The men were convinced it was done by Muslims because the whole video was a "lie". It wasn't showing the truth of Islam. And then I realized that most of these men really did think that all Muslims were terrorists. They really had painted with one broad stroke all people within Islam. I could hear the frustration and angry intolerance in their voices. People actually convert to Islam? One guy even asked, "So what about the Jews? They look just like 'em how can you even tell 'em apart?"
They were surprised to find out that only 1/3 of all muslims are actually Arab. Many Indonesians, Africans, Pakistani, Europeans and many Americans have converted to Islam. They had no idea why anyone would want to turn Muslim and seemed puzzled why anyone would even consider it. I shared briefly about how many are unsatisfied with Western Culture and commercialism and feel disenfranchised by the American Dream. Islam plays into that nicely by providing a counter culture that stands in opposition to the many things that have marginalized people. (of course I didn't say it quite like that). Islam means 'submission' which is a concept that stands juxtaposed to all of the personal freedoms we enjoy.
They looked at me as though I had an alien crawling out of my chest. I mentioned that anger and intolerance from Christians and Americans appears to be "persecution" and provides validity to the cause of Islam. I am in no way advocating tolerance of Islam as "one way" to God. I believe Christ is the only way, the truth and the life. But how do we dialogue with Muslims in culture? How do we present our message without looking like the bad guys?
Pastor mentioned a conversation with a missionary from Tanzinia
and how much money Muslims pour into mission projects in Africa. People look at their choices: beautiful mosques, nice food, clothing and schools OR dirt floors, rice and Americanization.
I admit I do not have much contact with Islam. But I think this will become a growing problem for the church in America. How do we communicate our message effectively?
Our topic was Islam. We watched part of a video done by the Southern Baptist Convention on Muslims entitled "Crescent or Cross". Believe it or not, it was well done. It showed Muslims not as the bloodthirsty terrorists we often see on TV. But it showed them as peaceful, intellectual and friendly. It was very disarming and I could tell it was really challenging the men in the group.
We had a time of discussion after watching about half of the video. The men were convinced it was done by Muslims because the whole video was a "lie". It wasn't showing the truth of Islam. And then I realized that most of these men really did think that all Muslims were terrorists. They really had painted with one broad stroke all people within Islam. I could hear the frustration and angry intolerance in their voices. People actually convert to Islam? One guy even asked, "So what about the Jews? They look just like 'em how can you even tell 'em apart?"
They were surprised to find out that only 1/3 of all muslims are actually Arab. Many Indonesians, Africans, Pakistani, Europeans and many Americans have converted to Islam. They had no idea why anyone would want to turn Muslim and seemed puzzled why anyone would even consider it. I shared briefly about how many are unsatisfied with Western Culture and commercialism and feel disenfranchised by the American Dream. Islam plays into that nicely by providing a counter culture that stands in opposition to the many things that have marginalized people. (of course I didn't say it quite like that). Islam means 'submission' which is a concept that stands juxtaposed to all of the personal freedoms we enjoy.They looked at me as though I had an alien crawling out of my chest. I mentioned that anger and intolerance from Christians and Americans appears to be "persecution" and provides validity to the cause of Islam. I am in no way advocating tolerance of Islam as "one way" to God. I believe Christ is the only way, the truth and the life. But how do we dialogue with Muslims in culture? How do we present our message without looking like the bad guys?
Pastor mentioned a conversation with a missionary from Tanzinia
and how much money Muslims pour into mission projects in Africa. People look at their choices: beautiful mosques, nice food, clothing and schools OR dirt floors, rice and Americanization.I admit I do not have much contact with Islam. But I think this will become a growing problem for the church in America. How do we communicate our message effectively?
21 comentarios:
I would not like to see and alien crawling out of your chest either, Mike. But I can imagine the looks you recieved. There is so much knee-jerk reaction stuff that occurs in the mix of all that. So many good intentions are lost on those reactions, not that I have that much experience with Islam either.
JIHAD !!!!!!!!
i like the first picture
I think Nic would have been a good Muslim.
Mike, this is one of your better posts. I find it interesting that most Christians are supportive of Judaism (which tries to discredit Christ even more than Islam) yet are completely intolerant of Muslims. Check out this guy (cleave.pomomusings.com). He has some very interesting posts on this issue on his blog. He is a seminary student at Princeton. He is a little over the edge for me, but I like his thinking process.
M2. Dont let peaceful Muslims lull you to sleep. While I do not hate them, I beleive a peaceful Muslim is every bit as dangerous as a militant Muslim. What is worse, a militant Muslim detonating himself in a public place, or a peaceful Muslim converting an someone to Islam? In my eyes either end is equally disturbing. They are all terrosits, whether it be in the physical sense or in the spirital sense.
To Anonymous, By that line of thinking, anyone who is not a Christian and leads others away from Christ is a terrorist. While I do not agree with Jehovah's Witness' or Mormons I cannot group them with Muslim terrorism. What is worse, a Christian who refuses to dialogue with people of different faiths or a Christian or a Christian filled with hate for anyone who is not a believer in Christ?
I do not think Muslims are harmless. I do not think we should overlook "peaceful" Muslims. But I think Satan is our adversary. People, though sometimes used by the enemy, are not the enemy. If I decide to punch every Muslim I see in the mouth, chances are I will not find any Muslims who would be willing to listen to anything I have to say.
The church needs to be very intentional in how it interacts with Islam. Paranoia or anger, while possibly warranted as a reaction to fear of terrorism, may not be the best approach for evangelizing.
Thanks for posting Mr./Ms. Anonymous. I assume by the "M2" that you are from Tyler.
This is a great posting and I think it really exposes our prejudices and an underlying fear that has gripped much of the church. The very fact that so many people are unable to tell the difference between a terrorist and an adherent to Islam is revealing. Is no one concerned about "Christian" terrorism? This is still a problem is some parts of the world. And as for how to dialogue with Muslims...It seems to me that Jesus and the apostles were much more harsh when speaking to/against the established church than when speaking to those who were blinded by false religions.
Joel!! You found me!
Thanks for the post.
I find this very interesting, especially since Islam in no way denounces Christ. Muslims are actually also waiting for Christ, and have a lot of respect for him. They believe that Christ's birth was a miracle and feel that he was an amazing and pious individual. Muslims are also taught to respect all Christians, especially since Christians have excepted the message to Christ to the best of their ability. Now how much the Church has conveyed is a different story. I will not even go there. We all know how the European Churches changed religion according to their agenda.
Hey!
I think giving sufficient evidence and facts to prove your religion is all u guys need! and another thing is that u need to educate people of what makes Christianity better than Islam. But, I don't think you would get any muslims believing u because non of them accept the christians today and the reason is that Chritians have changed the words of the Bible so much, you can't tell what part of it is the actual text or is it the fake ones that have been replaced by christians!
and another thing is respecting their culture and beliefes will do u good! ;) GOOD LUCK
one interesting fact i just came upon was the fact that islam does not deny that christianity exists. muslims simply believe that a new religion was founded after christianity. You cant say that all americans are red necks, or that all germans hate jews... you cant say all muslims are terrorist either. salam is the way muslims great each other.. it means PEACE! idiot people who are uneducated in islam would blow themselves up in the name of islam. had they taken the time to study islam they would have known that killing yourself and other innocent people would land in the depths of hell! the prophet did not blow himself up nor did he encourage others... i think that you should be educated about a subject before expressing your opinion about said subject. before you go badmouthing a religion or a race you should open a book or two!!!
your only enemy is fear. islam is not the enemy and arabs are not the enemy. fear is. fear breeds hate and hate breeds violence. if you ever want to know about arabs or islam let me know and i will be more than willing to help you. i am a christian who is arab and grew up american so i can rpesent things accuretly as well as in a way that you understand. islam is a good religion and beautiful..... it is not to be feared or hated. contact me i would love to know what you have been taught at church and tell you the truth.
im muslim. if u expect all muslims to be terrorist ur crazy. i believe if everyone calls us terrorists we have a right to do the same to u but its against our religion.
It should be stated , that Muslims do not seek to put down or desecrete the Holy Bible. It is a matter critical matter of faith for Muslims to believe in the original revelations that came down to Moses, David, Solomon and Jesus, just as it is is important for Muslims to believe in the revelation of the Quran that came to Muhammad, peace be upon him. The key word here however, is "original." As we all know the origin of the Bible is clouded with centuries of copying, translating and passing down information, now long lost with only copies of manuscripts remaining to remind us of what once was the Bible.
Additionally, it should be noted that Muslims do not seek to destroy the Christians or Jews belief in the Word of God, rather it is an obligation for Muslims to call to what is right and to halt that which is evil. Certainly, causing the "People of the Book" (as the Quran refers to Christians and Jews) to fall into disbelief and leave off any faith in God at all, is the very opposite of the direction Muslims should take in presenting any comparison between Islam and what has come down in the past from the Almighty God. We only seek to bring about more light to the people seeking guidance and pray for all of us to be successful with our Lord in this life and in the Next life and we ask His Guidance and Support in doing so, ameen.
Islam is from GOD (Allah in arabic), The Creator and Sustainer of all that exists. As such, it is for Him Alone to command and direct His creation and He Alone is responsible for what He will accept and what He will not accept. It is also for Him Alone to decree what is good and what is bad and He must be the One to show the right path in all things.
Everything in the life of the creations of Allah, especially for those who have choices to make (us), must be dictated and clarified by the One who Created everything in the fist place. We understand from this that Islam must be a complete and total way of living, explaining everything in the life from beginning to end and from birth until death.
Islam is careful to remind us that it not a religion to be paid mere lip service; rather it is an all-encompassing way of life that must be practiced continuously for it to be Islam.
There are other injunctions and commandments which concern virtually all facets of one's personal, family and civic life. These include such matters as diet, clothing, personal hygiene, interpersonal relations, business ethics, responsibilities towards parents, spouse and children, marriage, divorce and inheritance, civil and criminal law, fighting in defense of Islam, relations with non-Muslims, and so much more.
In conclusion, we are forced to realize that ISLAM is a complete way of life for the human being. Everything is covered in Islam from birth to death to live in the complete submission to the Will of the One Who Created man in the first place.
Terrorism quiz
________________________________________
With no offence to brothers/sisters here , I have got this from a friend.
1) Which is the only country in the world to have dropped bombs on over twenty different countries since 1945?
2)Which is the only country to have used nuclear weapons?
3)Which country was responsible for a car bomb which killed 80 civilians in Beirut in 1985, in a botched assassination attempt, thereby making it the most lethal terrorist bombing in modern Middle East history?
4)Which country's illegal bombing of Libya in 1986 was described by the UN Legal Committee as a "classic case" of terrorism?
5)Which country rejected the order of the International Court of Justice (ICJ) to terminate its "unlawful use of force" against Nicaragua in 1986, and then vetoed a UN Security Council resolution calling on all states to observe international law?
6) Which country was accused by a UN-sponsored truth commission of providing "direct and indirect support" for "acts of genocide" against the Mayan Indians in Guatemala during the 1980s?
7)Which country unilaterally withdrew from the Anti-Ballistic Missile (ABM) Treaty in December 2001?
8)Which country renounced the efforts to negotiate a verification process for the Biological Weapons Convention and brought an international conference on the matter to a halt in July 2001?
9)Which country prevented the United Nations from curbing the gun trade at a small arms conference in July 2001?
10)Aside from Somalia , which is the only other country in the world to have refused to ratify the UN Convention on the Rights of the Child?
11)Which is the only Western country which allows the death penalty to be applied to children?
12)Which is the only G7 country to have refused to sign the 1997 Mine Ban Treaty, forbidding the use of landmines?
13)Which is the only G7 country to have voted against the creation of the International Criminal Court (ICC) in 1998?
14)Which was the only other country to join with Israel in opposing a 1987 General Assembly resolution condemning international terrorism?
15)Which country refuses to fully pay its debts to the United Nations yet reserves its right to veto United Nations resolutions?
And the answer is................................................ ................................
and you caling all muslim terrorist think before you make staiment?
ISLAMIC BELIEFS
CHRISTIAN BELIEFS
Allah (God Almighty) is the only Creator of all that exists.
God Almighty is the only Creator of all that exists. (Gen. 1:1)
There is one God (Allah). Jesus is the Christ, miracle birth- and Muhammad (peace be upon him) is his last prophet, both of them said, "God is One and you have to serve Him with all your heart, mind and strength.
There is one God. He exists eternally in three persons, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. (There is no "Trinity" in the Bible)
Allah reveals His 99 Divine Attributes and does not compare Himself to any of His creation.
God has revealed Himself as "One God" and "One Lord" (Deuteronomy 6:3; Mark 12:29)
Allah created man from dirt and "in His image" and of "His spirit," yet God has no likeness of anything in creation.
God created man from dirt and the image of God (Genesis 1)
Adam & Eve sinned, then repented and were forgiven, with no continuing effects on their children.
Adam and Eve sinned and thus brought sin into the world and their sins passed on to their children. (Genesis 3:1-7)
God Forgives Adam and Eve after they repent. Then He makes Adam his deputy (caliph) and the first prophet.
Original Sin - all of Adam's posterity are born with a sin nature and are sinful from birth (Romans 3:22-23, 1st John 1:10)
Man is basically good but prone to mistakes. Muslims who repent and submit to God are forgiven without intercession from Christ (or anyone) needed.
Man is by nature sinful and has need for redemption by the atonement of Jesus Christ (Romans 5:6, 8:32, Colossians 1:19-20, Hebrews 7:26-27, 9:26, 10:12, 1st John 4:10)
Through submission to the Will of God in peace, anyone, anytime, any place becomes a servant of Allah and draw closer to Him.
Through the work of Christ, God adopts Christians into His family and calls them His children (Romans 8:14-15, Ephesians 1:5, Galatians 4:5)
Allah is not like His creation. He is neither male nor female, nor is creation like Him.
Bible says; "God is not a man... not the son of man.." (Numbers 23:19) Other places contradicts this(?)
Muslims believe in the same Omnipotent, All-powerful, Unseen God that the Jews have believed in since Adam. However, unlike the Jews, Muslims join in with the Christians by also believing in Jesus as the "Christ"; "Messiah"; "Logos"; and "Miraculous Conception"; as well as all the previous Biblical prophets and their original scriptures that they brought. Muslims also believe that God is merciful and just to His creatures. So, they deny the concept of the 'Original Sin' [all children are born into the sins of their parents] and the 'Sacrificial Lamb' concept which requires the blood of Jesus, peace be upon him, to atone for the sins of the sinners. This being the case, how can Muslims say that God is just and that His revelation, the Bible, is corrupted? Where is it in God's great plan that His revelation loses all credibility? These are all very excellent questions.
It is a known fact that Jesus was regarded by his followers as a prophet and that what he preached was written down into physical form by his disciples. However, God placed the responsibility on humans to preserve the integrity of this message over time. When the people failed in their duty, it was made necessary for the Holy Quran to come into existence in order to correct the teachings that were changed. By God's mercy He revealed His will once again to Muhammad over 600 years later, and his companions similarly wrote it down and compiled it into what became known as The Holy Quran. By God's justice He promised that He would preserve it therefore making it the last revelation to humanity. Today an actual seventh century Quran, complete and intact, is on display in a museum in Istanbul, Turkey.
Amazing Revelation
What is Islam ?
Islam is not a new religion, but the same truth that God revealed through all His prophets to every people. For a fifth of the world's population, Islam is both a religion and a complete way of life. Muslims follow a religion of peace, mercy, and forgiveness, and the majority have nothing to do with the extremely grave events which have come to be associated with their faithWho are the Muslims?
One billion people from a vast range of races, nationalities and cultures across the globe - from the southern Philippines to Nigeria - are united by their common Islamic faith. About 18% live in the Arab world; the world's largest Muslim community is in Indonesia; substantial parts of Asia and most of Africa are Muslim, while significant minorities are to be found in the Soviet Union, China, North and South America, and Europe.
What do Muslims believe?
Muslims believe in One, Unique, Incomparable God; in the Angels created by Him; in the prophets through whom His revelations were brought to mankind; in the Day of Judgement and individual accountability for actions; in God's complete authority over human destiny and in life after death. Muslims believe in a chain of prophets starting with Adam and including Noah, Abraham, Ishmael, Isaac, Jacob, Joseph, Job, Moses, Aaron, David, Solomon, Elias, Jonah, John the Baptist, and Jesus, peace be upon them. But God's final message to man, a reconfirmation of the eternal message and a summing-up of all that has gone before was revealed to the Prophet Muhammad through Gabriel.What does 'Islam' mean?
The Arabic word 'Islam' simply means 'submission', and derives from a word meaning 'peace'. In a religious context it means complete submission to the will of God. 'Mohammedanism' is thus a misnomer because it suggests that Muslims worship Muhammad rather than God. 'Allah' is the Arabic name for God, which is used by Arab Muslims and Christians alike.
Why does Islam often seem strange?
Islam may seem exotic or even extreme in the modern world. Perhaps this is because religion does not dominate everyday life in the West today, whereas Muslims have religion always uppermost in their minds, and make no division between secular and sacred. They believe that the Divine Law, the Shari'a, should be taken very seriously, which is why issues related to religion are still so important.
Do Islam and Christianity have different origins?
No. Together with Judaism, they go back to the prophet and patriarch Abraham, and their three prophets are directly descended from his sons Muhammad from the eldest, Ishmael, and Moses and Jesus from Isaac. Abraham established the settlement which today is the city of Makkah, and built the Ka'ba towards which all Muslims turn when they pray.
What is the Quran about?
The Quran, the last revealed Word of God, is the prime source of every Muslim's faith and practice. It deals with all the subjects which concern us as human beings: wisdom, doctrine, worship, and law, but its basic theme is the relationship between God and His creatures. At the same time it provides guidelines for a just society, proper human conduct and an equitable economic system.
Does Islam tolerate other beliefs?
The Quran says: God forbids you not, with regards to those who fight you not for [your] faith nor drive you out of your homes, from dealing kindly and justly with them; for God loveth those who are just. (Quran, 60:8)
It is one function of Islamic law to protect the privileged status of minorities, and this is why non-Muslim places of worship have flourished all over the Islamic world. History provides many examples of Muslim tolerance towards other faiths: when the caliph Omar entered Jerusalem in the year 634, Islam granted freedom of worship to all religious communities in the city.
Islamic law also permits non-Muslim minorities to set up their own courts, which implement family laws drawn up by the minorities themselves.
ABOVE: Mosque of Omar and Church of the Holy Sepulchre, Jerusalem. When the caliph Omar took Jerusalem from the Byzantines, he insisted on entering the city with only a small number of his companions. Proclaiming to the inhabitants that their lives and property were safe, and that their places of worship would never be taken from them, he asked the Christian patriarch Sophronius to accompany him on a visit to all the holy places.
The Patriarch invited him to pray in the Church of the Holy Sepulchre, but he preferred to pray outside its gates, saying that if he accepted, later generations of Muslims might use his action as an excuse to turn it into a mosque. Above is the mosque built on the spot where Omar did pray.
RIGHT: According to Islam, man is not born in 'original sin'. He is God's vicegerent on earth. Every child is born with the fitra, an innate disposition towards virtue, knowledge, and beauty. Islam considers itself to be the 'primordial religion', din al-hanif, it seeks to return man to his original, true nature in which he is in harmony with creation, inspired to do good, and confirming the Oneness of God.
What do Muslims think about Jesus?
Muslims respect and revere Jesus, and await his Second Coming. They consider him one of the greatest of God's messengers to mankind. A Muslim never refers to him simply as 'Jesus', but always adds the phrase 'upon him be peace'. The Quran confirms his virgin birth (a chapter of the Quran is entitled 'Mary'), and Mary is considered the purest woman in all creation. The Quran describes the Annunciation as follows:
'Behold!' the Angel said, 'God has chosen you, and purified you, and chosen you above the women of all nations. O Mary, God gives you good news of a word from Him, whose name shall be the Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, honored in this world and the Hereafter, and one of those brought near to God. He shall speak to the people from his cradle and in maturity, and shall be of the righteous.'
She said: 'O my Lord! How shall I have a son when no man has touched me?' He said: 'Even so; God creates what He will. When He decrees a thing, He says to it, "Be!" and it is.' (Quran, 3:42-7)
Jesus was born miraculously through the same power which had brought Adam into being without a father:
Truly, the likeness of Jesus with God is as the likeness of Adam. He created him of dust, and then said to him, 'Be!' and he was. (Quran, 3:59)
During his prophetic mission Jesus performed many miracles. The Quran tells us that he said:
I have come to you with a sign from your Lord: I make for you out of clay, as it were, the figure of a bird, and breathe into it and it becomes a bird by God's leave. And I heal the blind, and the lepers and I raise the dead by God's leave. (Quran, 3:49)
Neither Muhammad nor Jesus came to change the basic doctrine of the belief in One God, brought by earlier prophets, but to confirm and renew it. In the Quran Jesus is reported as saying that he came:
To attest the law which was before me. And to make lawful to you part of what was forbidden you; I have come to you with a sign from your Lord, so fear God and obey Me. (Quran, 3:5O)
The Prophet Muhammad said:
Whoever believes there is no god but God, alone without partner, that Muhammad is His messenger, that Jesus is the servant and messenger of God, His word breathed into Mary and a spirit emanating from Him, and that Paradise and Hell are true, shall be received by God into Heaven. (Hadith from Bukhari)
Welcome to the blog "Anonymous". It appears you had a lot to say on this topic.
Typically, the comments in a blog are a good place for dialogue (more than one person talking back and forth). Your 6 long comments may not create much dialogue as it is difficult to respond to such a vast amount of information.
Your welcome to comment to posts here, I might ask if you would help to make it a little easier for someone to comment in return by not posting 6 times in a row with large amounts of text. Most people (including myself) don't always read comments that contain that much stuff.
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